[Solved] Top Tool Inch users

CADCAM machining solution: mill-turn centers, milling and turning, kinematics, fixtures, topology recognition, tool library, manufacturing schedules, realistic simulation, workshop sheets, post-processors and DNC...

Moderators: remi77, Daniel, jacs

User avatar
Matt Berube
Master Corporal
Master Corporal
Posts: 45
Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2007 7:08 pm
Location: Connecticut, USA

[Solved] Top Tool Inch users

Unread post by Matt Berube » Wed Mar 07, 2007 9:03 pm

I would like to hear opinions and advice about Top Tool from INCH users.

I am new to this but spent 2 days trying to center drill, drill, and counter-bore 4 holes and I am still not satisfied with the results.

I enjoyed the process of defining a new machine. It is relatively straightforward with only minor confusing quirks. TopTool, however is really giving me a hard time. :? :? :?

Anybody ?
TopSolid 2006, Design 6.7.302, Cam 6.7.302, Mold 6.7.302

Mastercam X2, Mill3, Wire, Solids, Moldplus, Beta Tester

User avatar
remi77
Administator
Administator
Posts: 280
Joined: Thu Feb 22, 2007 10:05 am
Contact:

Unread post by remi77 » Thu Mar 08, 2007 7:48 am

Hello

You wrote
TopTool, however is really giving me a hard time
What's wrong with it :?:

Cheers

Rémi :wink:

User avatar
Matt Berube
Master Corporal
Master Corporal
Posts: 45
Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2007 7:08 pm
Location: Connecticut, USA

Unread post by Matt Berube » Thu Mar 08, 2007 1:51 pm

Hello Remi,

I initially had been using the Top Tool that came with my TopSolid install but recently when I told my VAR I had problems he gave me Top Tool Inches. This newer version is definitely improved in some ways. It is nice to have more tools and holders (links) available. I also like the new workpiece materials which are much more familiar to me than the old version...

The problems I am having could be my own fault but I don't know.

1. I can't find any help file or documentation for Top Tool so it is difficult to try to figure out what I am supposed to do.

2. After installing this new version of Top Tool, I created a new machine with a link type "CAT50" which I can only assume is a valid choice. This new machine won't import a holder (link) with a 50 taper. All I get is 40 taper holders. I suppose I could just ignore it and continue but that takes away some of the simulation benefits.

3. When defining sizes of anything in TopTool, I find I must type "in" after every value or TopSolid thinks that ".5" equals .5mm....... To get correct results I must remember to type ".5in"

4. This may belong in "enhancement request" but it's related so I will include it here. I often use counter-bores as shown below. I would like to be able to select a counter-bore like this in Top Tool, define the length of the "pilot diameter", and have TopSolid automatically manage the retract for me. In the machine we would set the "Z" from the tip of the actual "counterbore dia". I thought I saw some kind of counter-bore with a "pilot" in the old Top Tool but cannot find it now so I just use flat bottom drill. It works but it is not ideal.
Image

5. I keep seeing symbols I don't understand in the link section of many areas of Top Tool. Click picture for better view...
Image

6. There should be a way to update an old "machine" or "template" to fully take advantage of Top Tool. Maybe it's just my inexperience but my old machine files could import the new tools but would not calculate sensible speed / feed parameters. Every tool came in 9999 RPM. This was solved by creating a new machine after installing Top Tool Inch.

7. The Top Tool windows should be re-sizable so if we have lots of columns we could drag the window larger and view more columns at once.

8. This marker does not perform correctly. It moves back to the center position whether we are at the top or the bottom of the list...
Image

9. When working in this dialog, I can't tell what type of holder (link) I am looking at without looking up a code in a Kennametal catalog. I would like to see a display like "Mill-cat50" with each tool. This would make it a lot easier to get the tool I am looking for. 3 pictures to show all of the columns in this window...
ImageImageImage

10. If I start Top Tool and select CUTTING CONDITIONS >> FEEDRATE, I get everything under that menu in French language.

11. If I start Top Tool and select DESCRIPTION >> CATALOGS >> WORKSHOP COMPONENTS, choose Database for Missler, OK...
That spawns a new window and if I then select CATALOG >> ALL TYPES, I end up in a third window. If I try to use "filters" from this window, I end up in a situation which I can't cancel out of and I have to CTRL-ALT-DEL (shut down TopSolid) to get out.

12. In the "Database for Missler" (DESCRIPTION >> CATALOGS >> WORKSHOP COMPONENTS, choose Database for Missler, OK) they have the #6 center drill as 5/8 dia. It should be 1/2. I would like to be able to re-name this tool to the correct name (#7) but it seems I am not allowed to.

13. What is "Top Draw" ? I find that if I select a tool and click "modify" then switch to the "general" tab, There is a Top Draw button which errors out when selected.

14. If I start TopTool and select CONFIGURATION >> DICTIONARY, There is a choice of "Default units" (none, metric, or imperial) and it is stuck on none. I cannot change it. Perhaps this could solve my issue #3 ?

15. In this picture, if I click a dropdown in the "test" column, as soon as I move my cursor into the small dropdown window, all of the choices disappear. It is difficult to make the correct choice.
Image

I hope this post is not offensive to anybody. I am not trying to start trouble. I would just like to get TopSolid Cam to the point where I can use it with confidence.
TopSolid 2006, Design 6.7.302, Cam 6.7.302, Mold 6.7.302

Mastercam X2, Mill3, Wire, Solids, Moldplus, Beta Tester

User avatar
remi77
Administator
Administator
Posts: 280
Joined: Thu Feb 22, 2007 10:05 am
Contact:

Unread post by remi77 » Thu Mar 08, 2007 3:17 pm

Hello

You wrote
If I start TopTool and select CONFIGURATION >> DICTIONARY, There is a choice of "Default units" (none, metric, or imperial) and it is stuck on none. I cannot change it. Perhaps this could solve my issue #3 ?
To do this, you've to click on:
Configuration-> dictionnary, the select your default units, then click on "execute a procedure", select "BDSetUnit.wgl" and validate to get your default value for the whole Toptool.
It's of course solving your issue #3

Cheers

Rémi :wink:
Last edited by remi77 on Fri Mar 09, 2007 7:44 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
remi77
Administator
Administator
Posts: 280
Joined: Thu Feb 22, 2007 10:05 am
Contact:

Unread post by remi77 » Thu Mar 08, 2007 3:30 pm

Hello
13. What is "Top Draw" ? I find that if I select a tool and click "modify" then switch to the "general" tab, There is a Top Draw button which errors out when selected.
Topdraw is a good way to check the tool you've created (or already got)
Maybe it's just my inexperience but my old machine files could import the new tools but would not calculate sensible speed / feed parameters.
Be careful , each speed/feed parameters is associated with one material to machine, select a material first, then enter your speed/feed parameters.

Toptool is composed of basic tools, you can't add new parameters otherwise, you've got to create "special mill" (in case of milling tool of course).

Be careful, in definition tool, all letters must be UPPERCASE

At that time, don't care about filters, first learn how to create a tool correctly, the best is to start from scratch :wink:

Hoping to have been helpful.

Cheers
Rémi :wink:

User avatar
Matt Berube
Master Corporal
Master Corporal
Posts: 45
Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2007 7:08 pm
Location: Connecticut, USA

Unread post by Matt Berube » Thu Mar 08, 2007 6:22 pm

Topdraw is a good way to check the tool you've created (or already got)


All I ever get when I click on TopDraw is messages like this:

Image
TopSolid 2006, Design 6.7.302, Cam 6.7.302, Mold 6.7.302

Mastercam X2, Mill3, Wire, Solids, Moldplus, Beta Tester

User avatar
Matt Berube
Master Corporal
Master Corporal
Posts: 45
Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2007 7:08 pm
Location: Connecticut, USA

Unread post by Matt Berube » Thu Mar 08, 2007 6:29 pm

To do this, you've to click on:
Configuration-> dictionnary, the select your default units, then click on "execute a procedure", select "BDSetUnit.wgl" and validate to get your default value for the whole Toptool.
It's of course solving your issue #3
I tried this but there is a problem. I cannot move the 'dot' to metric or imperial. It is stuck on none. The rest of your procedure works but unfortunately I think it will only help if I can select "imperial" first.

It seems like there is definitely something missing in the English US configuration...
TopSolid 2006, Design 6.7.302, Cam 6.7.302, Mold 6.7.302

Mastercam X2, Mill3, Wire, Solids, Moldplus, Beta Tester

User avatar
reThinker
Private
Private
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2007 4:08 pm
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Contact:

Unread post by reThinker » Thu Mar 08, 2007 8:54 pm

I want to THANK Matt for brining this all to light. As a reseller in USA I have to agree that TopTool is lacking when it comes to working outside of metric. The new TopTool IN is a vast improvement but it still lacks many things. It is always helpful for Missler to hear these "needs for improvement" from users. If there are things that you feel need to be changed, please voice them, as the user's voice is the strongest!

User avatar
remi77
Administator
Administator
Posts: 280
Joined: Thu Feb 22, 2007 10:05 am
Contact:

Unread post by remi77 » Thu Mar 08, 2007 9:09 pm

Hello

Rethinker wrote:
If there are things that you feel need to be changed, please voice them, as the user's voice is the strongest!
That's it, you can ever post to suggestions and enhancements

Cheers

Rémi :wink:

User avatar
Matt Berube
Master Corporal
Master Corporal
Posts: 45
Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2007 7:08 pm
Location: Connecticut, USA

Unread post by Matt Berube » Fri Mar 09, 2007 12:03 am

reThinker wrote:I want to THANK Matt for brining this all to light. As a reseller in USA I have to agree that TopTool is lacking when it comes to working outside of metric. The new TopTool IN is a vast improvement but it still lacks many things. It is always helpful for Missler to hear these "needs for improvement" from users. If there are things that you feel need to be changed, please voice them, as the user's voice is the strongest!
Thanks for the support reThinker !

Thank you for all of your replies, Remi
TopSolid 2006, Design 6.7.302, Cam 6.7.302, Mold 6.7.302

Mastercam X2, Mill3, Wire, Solids, Moldplus, Beta Tester

User avatar
Bill
Master Chief
Master Chief
Posts: 115
Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2007 8:17 pm
TopSolid Module: TopSolid'Design
TopSolid Version: 7.5
Location: Chicago
Contact:

Regarding the new TopTool Inch

Unread post by Bill » Mon Mar 12, 2007 10:28 pm

Hello to all!

I would like to let you all know some things regarding to the new TopTool Inch Database. I too am a distributor in the US. From what I understand, the final version of TopTool Inch Database should be available in a week or two. This final version will include training videos on how to create new tools in this new database.

When the final version is complete, and tested, I will post another message here with links to where you can download it from.

With the version that is out right now there are some bugs, (like having to type "in" manually after each field). These should all be gone in the final version. :)

Matt, for your holder problem, check that you have the following defined correctly.

Launch TopTool, and go to the Description pull down menu and choose Definition and then machine tool.

When the window pops up, find your machine (that's suppose to use the CAT50 holders), select it, and choose modify from the window.

Be sure that your Work Shop Group is set to: MISS_SHOP
And that your Link Type is set to: CAT50
And that your Machine Tool Group is set to : MILL-CAT50

Now, save and exit out of the machine list.
Now go to the Tools Definition pull down, and choose linked tools
Choose a center drill
Now before you do anything else, click on the machine button, (located on the top right hand side of the dialog box). From here select your machine.

Now, you should only see tools that have been linked with the CAT50 holder. If you don't, that means that you did not link them correctly. So try again from here. Hit the ADD button and link a new center drill with a holder. Be sure when you select your holder that you are choosing a CAT50.

If this doen't help, just let me know.


Until then, happy machining!

Bill
Happy Designing
Bill
Technical Director
Missler Software Inc

User avatar
Matt Berube
Master Corporal
Master Corporal
Posts: 45
Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2007 7:08 pm
Location: Connecticut, USA

Unread post by Matt Berube » Tue Mar 13, 2007 12:23 pm

Hi Bill,

Thanks for the information 8)

I just had a discovery. For the first time ever I just started Top Tool from my Windows Start menu instead of from within TopSolid. After starting this way I am allowed to change to Imperial units. Interesting...

Now that I have changed to Imperial units in Top Tool OUTSIDE of TopSolid, the setting seems to be working when Top Tool is spawned from within TopSolid as well. No more need to type "in" (at least in a quick test)...

I just finished following your procedure and it did give me a 50 taper tool holder. :D

Well that helps a lot. I'll be sure to post here with any other trouble I have. Thanks for the help.

Hey, what's that avatar all about ? Is there going to be a new TopSolid'SandRail module ? :P
TopSolid 2006, Design 6.7.302, Cam 6.7.302, Mold 6.7.302

Mastercam X2, Mill3, Wire, Solids, Moldplus, Beta Tester

User avatar
Francois
Private First Class
Private First Class
Posts: 19
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2007 6:15 pm
Location: Montreal
Contact:

other "issues" with top tool

Unread post by Francois » Tue Apr 17, 2007 8:35 pm

Hi to all, this is my first post...

I'd like to add some comments on what Matt posted...
I personnally experienced some of the same problems Matt had with Toptool like:

7. The Top Tool windows should be re-sizable so if we have lots of columns we could drag the window larger and view more columns at once. (this should really be "solved")

8. This marker does not perform correctly. It moves back to the center position whether we are at the top or the bottom of the list...

but I also had these problems:

Toptool often crashes (bringing TopSolid with him) when i reach either end of the list (usually the bottom) where the marker, that Matt is talking about, is.

I can't mount a countersink tool in the tool changer. I had to choose a chamfer tool but it doesn't seem to calculate depth vs countersink diameter properly...

I've only been a TopSolid user for a few months, so my problems may come from "lack" of practice or ... something else! :lol:
English is not my first language, so pardon my mistakes (Though I don't think I'm the only one here! this forum could be almost be in french)

And Matt, talking about language, I guess you know that your last name is
from french-canadian origins?

User avatar
Matt Berube
Master Corporal
Master Corporal
Posts: 45
Joined: Wed Feb 21, 2007 7:08 pm
Location: Connecticut, USA

Unread post by Matt Berube » Thu Apr 19, 2007 2:29 am

Hello Francois,

I find your english to be better than most Americans' english. :)

Yes, I am aware of the origins of my name. I still have many relatives in New Brunswick.
TopSolid 2006, Design 6.7.302, Cam 6.7.302, Mold 6.7.302

Mastercam X2, Mill3, Wire, Solids, Moldplus, Beta Tester

Top'Noob
First Officer Cadet
First Officer Cadet
Posts: 245
Joined: Fri Jun 15, 2007 3:05 pm

Unread post by Top'Noob » Wed Jun 20, 2007 11:23 am

I would like to let you all know some things regarding to the new TopTool Inch Database. I too am a distributor in the US. From what I understand, the final version of TopTool Inch Database should be available in a week or two. This final version will include training videos on how to create new tools in this new database.

When the final version is complete, and tested, I will post another message here with links to where you can download it from.

Hi Bill,

I tried to e-mail you this weekend but I must have gotten stuck in the spam filter or something...

Do you have any information about Top Tool Inches ?

Post Reply